Harness hang points...........

[Misk]

I could do with listening to a debate on different PG harness types!

High hang points vs. Low

On the Ice I was flying an Icaro Energylite harness - basically a re-branded Peak 1. The hang points are definitely high and with the Ice being 'high end 2' (whatever that means) I found the harness to be very active in choppy air. Lots of give required in the hips to maintain tension in risers.

Moving up to the Avax I've had to up my game further regarding active flying and at times am practically doing the rumba in the harness! The performance of the wing is still astonishing and it is a delight to fly BUT would I get more out of it on a low hang point harness? What are the pros and cons of high/low?

Whilst the racing canoes look fab they also look heavy - no good for Scotland (or at least me in Scotland). The Supair Rando XP looks lowish point and lightweight - can anyone recommend other alternatives?

[Sad Northerner]

Typically I've found that low hang points mean more feedback but it's hard to pin the characteristics in terms of feel a harness gives to hang point positioning alone. Factors such as seat width can also play a part in harness feedback as can chest strap adjustment and other configurations.
As far as pod harnesses are concerned, the only reason I'd buy one is so that I don't have to buy a flying suite.


Cheers

Ali

[gordie]

Thinking about a new harness aswell at the moment. Whilst at UK Airsports today I happened to check out the new Skyline Racer:

http://www.skyline-flightgear.de/index. ... =21765#img

It has fairly low hang points but the bit I did like was the detachable faring (canoe) which simply Velcro's on and off. Like Ali I would just want one of these for those cold winter days.

Having flown in a couple of these race pod harnesses I personal prefer a stir up set up with the option of sticking my legs where feels most comfortable at the time, especially on those stronger days. I did find I lost a lot of the feel I was getting from the wing whilst using them, with weight shifting being reduced making thermaling harder. However I would admit to being no expert in these designs.

It is a bit on the heavy side at 8kg with faring and 6.7kg with out

[gary stenhouse]

impress 2+ with ultralight reserve with stirup 8.3kg so not bad low hang points but very comportable in the air without been too roudy simlar to the genie but much beter on the stirup and the speedbar and and windskrt gives a realy good secure feel lots of space and lots of ajustment

going to fit the pod once i get it as like kit said once you get used to a pod most dont go back bit like been ginger. looking forward to keeping the leggs dry in the pod and withall the neoprene around me i will not feel like i can fall out, it's all about lie back and enjoy the ride.

[Kitt Rudd]

Ian,
I would have to agree with what Ali is saying that being Low hangpoints tends to give the pilot more feedback than high ones.

I am not wanting to diss one brand while being seen to promote another however I did find the likes of the impress harness (albeit comfortable) was less manoverable in terms of weightshift and is heavier than most whilst still not giving the pilot the best protection, I do however like the option of being able to remove the sock. Yet in practice I think once you have flown with the sock you you not revert.

PS I do have my old one going cheap

[ron freeman]

Agree with Ali G. Give the manufacture of the wing that you are flying and they will tell you all you need to know with reguards to the best harness for your wing. (watch out for the sales pitch though)

[gary stenhouse]

on the thought after my accident i went to a wv peak2 and a alti rando for weight and i would say that the harness wing comb is more important than wing by itself. i changed back to the genie as it give me the right info to the wing and also stoped the wing going soft as much, due to better movement and keeping the wing loaded all the time. as for the impress peak combo as the peak talks through its breaks a lot and although you do wobble about the wing does absorb a lot of the movements with very small inputt. worth trying a few as i would say a harness can make a wing feel so different and may end up ou not liking a wing through the harness

[brian day]

practically doing the rumba

Lots of give required in the hips

Don't know much about the harness debate, but I'd stick with what you're doing, at least it may pay dividends and keep a smile on Naiomi's face!

I have read a few times that a pilot who is confident in their equipment will fly further and better than an uncomfortable pilot on hot kit.
Maybe the answer is to have something for 'Scotland' and a slug for comps. Whatever you choose Ian. I'm sure you will get the most out of it.

[gordie]

" once you get used to a pod most dont go back"

I would disagree with this comment. Most people who move up to a canoe who are not very experience pilots do not like them. As I said you lose a lot of feel with them and become a lot more susceptible to collapses as it is harder to keep tension in the wing whilst in rough air, even if flying a relatively benign wing DHV 2 e.t.c. Also if you were to spin your wing then your body would be left behind due to the yaw effect.

I thing most people who are not full on race pilots (who might notice the difference in performance) get them to simply look good and aspire to be a sky god.

I would be very careful attaching one to a performance design whilst still getting to use to it. You may feel and think you look great whilst its smooth but once you hit the bouncy stuff you may end up crying like a baby!

[Mike Brown]

[quote="gordie"]"
I thing most people who are not full on race pilots (who might notice the difference in performance) get them to simply look good.....quote]

Hi Gordie,
Have to disagree here. I think people look complete D**ks in them!!
Cheers
Mike

[Misk]

Great input thanks guys. It's quickly cleared up some confusion! For a long time I'd roughly thought low hang points = LOTS of feedback. More feedback than my current harness would be undesirable. Recently though a few pilots, some very experienced, have given me the opposite impression hence the confusion.

Weight is a prime issue with kit up here and I've been investing with Steve and Kitt to bring that down. I don't like the idea of putting the pounds on again. The inertia of the pilot in a pod when the wing spins also put me off canoes for a while but again I've heard respected pilots saying it just isn't an issue with more recent designs. I think maybe a harness with a stirrup may be the step forward as a compromise.

There is always the possibility that I am just not as relaxed as some under a paraglider and there is still a bit of overreaction involved at the moment. It's a funny old thing - your up there all alone and don't know what it is SUPPOSED to feel like At least hang gliders are nice and simple to drive.

Keep the advice and opinions coming, it's great to put all your experience in one place. For now I'm just tightening the chest strap and plugging Shakira into the iPOD.

[milleboy]

Hi

I would disagree with most of the post on here....................but I won't, since Misk has stated that weight is important to him he really isn't going to be interested in pods or 6kg harnesses! If anyone is interested on my thought on pods and stability get in touch.

Ian, the peaks stability/weight shift is radically effected by the leg strap tension. This has more of an effect that any other factor! Hang it up in a rig and give us a shout!

[Fingers]

Ronny Johnson's right about Ali Johnson being right.

[Neil]

ian you can have a go of my pod if u like.
It scares the shit out of me in the rough.
Im taking it to tinto see you there